tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post6045025390819755985..comments2024-03-26T14:07:32.489-04:00Comments on Miles to Mozart: Lyrical Lyrita SRCS 34, Holst, Various Works, Imogen Holst Conductingaqlamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14158533801520443218noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-82540675505955345162019-10-27T11:09:57.569-04:002019-10-27T11:09:57.569-04:00Thank you Philip Stuart!
https://umusic.app.box.co...Thank you Philip Stuart!<br />https://umusic.app.box.com/s/0vzr182l9er58w58p89ncim2cev4qu1w<br /><br />If link above does not work go to eloquenceclassics, news, discography and first link is the new version of pdf we reference. (I use this frequently myself before buying any Decca/London etc.)<br /><br />Also there is online Decca Classics catalog and deutsche gramophoneMeleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-79774873904246507162019-10-27T07:52:04.362-04:002019-10-27T07:52:04.362-04:00my Decca discography (2019 edition) is freely avai...my Decca discography (2019 edition) is freely available from the Australian Eloquence websiteAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-26655928821298935792014-02-23T15:13:49.067-05:002014-02-23T15:13:49.067-05:00I have a 1S1S of 2436. It isn't in great shape...I have a 1S1S of 2436. It isn't in great shape, but I got it for around $100! The others I have seen within the past few years have all been in the $500 range. I had one I picked up in the mid '90's before I knew about the differences between 1S and later pressings. It was $3.98 as I remember. Unfortunately, I traded it for a bunch of Mercuries, before I knew better to keep it! I have been digitizing my collection (details upon request) and was able to get rid of the egregious pops out of the 1S1S. Sounds very good now in digital playback.<br /><br />There is a big difference between the 1S and later pressings both in price and sound quality. As you probably know, when RCA first released 2436, people complained that their players couldn't track the deep bass. So RCA recalled the 1S records and recut the record to get rid of the problem bass. So it explains both the difference in sound quality and rarity of the 1S. I bought a Decca pressing of the British version - but it doesn't have the low bass. Chad's new release does have it. For $30 that is a steal. <br /><br />Larry<br /><br />astrotoyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18238986044554305563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-38054657948788238562014-02-21T11:13:21.106-05:002014-02-21T11:13:21.106-05:00Actually, I don't have the 1s/1s Pines. I'...Actually, I don't have the 1s/1s Pines. I've had later stampers but never the 1s/1s. It's a rare bird. The Reiner Sound I got for about $24. The Reiner Pictures I acquired two copies 10 years ago, one which I bought for $1 and sold, the other I was given by a friend.aqlamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14158533801520443218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-16696022545453556012014-02-21T10:43:41.979-05:002014-02-21T10:43:41.979-05:00By "got" for less than $30, I think you ...By "got" for less than $30, I think you meant stole! 1s/1s pines, don't tell me you got a copy of that for less than $30! I don't have original Reiner Sound (rare). It might be possible to get the Reiner Pictures under $30 if one is lucky.Meleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-11805090530496074152014-02-21T08:52:35.487-05:002014-02-21T08:52:35.487-05:00Hi Larry,
Thank you very much for the info on MHS...Hi Larry,<br /><br />Thank you very much for the info on MHS! Good luck with your mini shootout this weekend. I have been wondering whether or not to dish out the dough to get the Analogue Productions reissues. There are only a handful that I would really consider purchasing, and they would be ones for which I have the originals. Please let us know your impressions. The ones available that I would consider would be the Reiner Respighi Fountains and Pines of Rome (do you have the 1s/1s for comparison?), The Reiner Sound, and Reiner's Pictures at an Exhibition. For $30 a pop, I'd have to pick carefully, since I was able to get my copies of the originals for quite a bit less.aqlamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14158533801520443218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-89199342087122159192014-02-21T02:23:49.657-05:002014-02-21T02:23:49.657-05:00Larry ,
Played nimbus srcs 33 Bliss Music for Stri...Larry ,<br />Played nimbus srcs 33 Bliss Music for Strings and it was electric. Great nimbus sound with tremendous life. Gotta spare.<br /><br />MelesMeleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-75994822431549990532014-02-21T02:15:16.577-05:002014-02-21T02:15:16.577-05:00Playing srcs 38 Finzi. 3R/1L 77 Decca press based ...Playing srcs 38 Finzi. 3R/1L 77 Decca press based on date on liner. Same stamp as your Dutch. PolyGram? Very, very effective record. Sounds like they reused the early stampers for later pressings in some cases. A midrange crooner to make a deccaphile proud.Meleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-23580787749261867352014-02-20T22:28:50.318-05:002014-02-20T22:28:50.318-05:00Just a quick response. Miles, thanks again for the...Just a quick response. Miles, thanks again for the extra info on the Nimbus pressings. I had heard that there was a difference between the having Nimbus stampers (with the block NIMBUS in the deadwax) and just having Nimbus do the pressings with the hand written stampers. The wide ring was supposed to be an indication of Nimbus pressing, but not necessarily Nimbus stampers. I think that is consistent with the info you have. Arthur, as far as alternatives, since the Lyritas are sometime hard to get, MHS did quite a few and Harry Pearson likes the Bax Symphony 6 as one of his Super Discs in the MHS issue. There was a company in the early '80's called HNH IIRC (maybe it was named for Harvey N Hunt or someone with a similar name.) Absolute sound did some comparisons between their Lyrita issues and the Lyrita originals. Usually it was very close. If you can find them, they should be cheap and good. I remember getting a few, back then, but shortly afterwards, I started going to London and also there were importers of Lyritas and I could get the originals. <br /><br />Larryastrotoyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18238986044554305563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-16717265525329520362014-02-20T17:56:34.319-05:002014-02-20T17:56:34.319-05:00The nimbus also did well. At first they sounded a...The nimbus also did well. At first they sounded a bit diffuse, but I did a major room tweek while playing the esteemed Arnold Dances. In the back wall of my listening area I have a closet in one corner and a small bathroom in the other, with another door to the hallway towards the center of the back wall. Just closing all three of these put the hall sound and all dynamics through the roof with SRCS 108 Arnold Dances. This really made the nimbus Arnold come to life. I'd been messing with this before and with the decca lyritas the doors definantly gave better sound with more hall sound. I'd forgotten to shut them and did so about midway through side 2 and my jaw hit the floor. I'll have to give the EMI pressings another listen as well as some of the Decca in this environment. I listened to my Boult Marches Nimbus (SRCS 73) which was that funny pressing without the typical nimbus label indent pattern (just the groove at 5/8 inch from center). It was crazy dynamic. I definitely need to relisten and will do some more tonight. It looks like tomorrow I get to listen to the Quads and we'll see how much Lyrita/classical the jazz loving Quadophile will put up with. The jury is still out on the different Nimbus (swayback versus switchback) and I may not have enough data points to do anything, but guess....<br /><br />Just found a cool hit on the internet on this swayback at 1.5 inches:<br />" ‘We have found some items you are seeking, but I thought I'd add an extra note of clarification. I have just spoken to the owner of the Lyrita label, and he assures me that the criteria for recognizing Nimbus pressings are not quite as you put it. The marking or engraving of the disc with the words "Nimbus" merely indicates the metal parts were made by Nimbus. Nimbus pressings can be recognized be a second concentric ring on the label about 2" (actually 1-1/2") out from the centre hole. This is a less distinct ring than the sharp cut close to the centre hole? Most titles (all except SRCS 65, 68, 71, 83, 102, 107, and 121/2) are now out of print? We have some of the other Lyrita numbers you list, but they were not pressed by Nimbus and probably never have been." (I’ll note for the readers that what we care about are the metal parts which is who mastered the disc and controlled most of the sound. Based on this I’d say all of the EMI mastered stuff was Nimbus pressings. SRCS 73 above is mastered by nimbus, but pressed by someone else. Nimbus pressings tend to have quieter surfaces.)<br /><br />"You (and/or 'arold Moores, et al) miss-out the info that Polygram (Phonodisc Ilford pressing plant, Roden St) pressed Lyrita for a short period after Decca's New Malden factory was closed-down. <br /><br />You can find Decca masterings with the Polygram-style metalwork for SRCS 109 (Uncle Arnold's Dances) and as used for Polygram-eras Decca LP's - coupled with a 1979 Decca mastering..and SRCS 69 ('erbert Howells) with the hand engraved matrices...all dating from 1980/81. <br /><br />Easily identifiable as Phonodisc pressings, due to the flat/raised label edge."<br />(Larry, I think this might be the dutch pressing you are referring to? Not sure what a flat/raised label edge means.)<br /><br />I've got a lot more listening to do before my opinions will be completed, but I find the Neumann SX68 Decca pressings to be problematic on my system at this point. They just do not always deliver enough lyricism in the highs, nor dynamics. The handwritten EMI and Nimbus masterings seem to be more consistent and are always quiets since they are typical Nimbus swayback pressings.<br />I just found I have two nimbus pressings of SRCS 33 Bliss Music for Strings, so that is almost all of the early ones in some shape or form.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Miles<br />Meleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-35098179063359565152014-02-20T17:55:25.609-05:002014-02-20T17:55:25.609-05:00Larry,
Cool. I think it would be very interesting...Larry,<br />Cool. I think it would be very interesting to here from Mr. Mailes about what might have made Lyrita unique from Decca? I wonder if Mr. Itter had any input on the process. I went to the Charm website and don't see anything there currently on Lyrita.... aah... I found it under downloads, Philip Stuart Decca Classical Discography, 1929-2009, http://charm.cch.kcl.ac.uk/download/download.html This information is amazing as it exceeds what they show on the CD releases from a few years back. I love seeing the recording hall information as those are famous well known halls. I just search for the keyword Lyrita and I can jump through or the album code. Nice, nice!<br /><br />It would be awesome to know about LP mastering. I particularly find the half-speed area for the first ten years of stereo very interesting. I do believe it was all the way into the Lyritas.<br /><br />I did some quick listening last night to my doubles and then concentrated on the early Lyrita. I have no groove pressings and it looks like they are possible only for the first four stereo titles (to SRCS 35). I wonder if there is one iota of difference in what the engineers were doing between ED2 and ED3 at this transition. I suspect that for Decca/London release that an ED2 (groove) of something put out in 1964 would sound different from an ED3 (flat) pressing of the same title made about four years later. I am not sure what it means for early Lyrita. With Decca/London it seems the narrow band roughly coincides with the advent of the helium cooled Neumann cutters. <br /><br />As far as listening results, in a nutshell, I think for these early releases the earliest pressing might be worth searching out. From listening to my doubles I am not a fan of the early Neumann Decca cuts. They don't seem all that dynamic and I'd absolutely go for an ED2 or ED3 whenever possible. ED4 would be Neumann on Decca and I think by 1975 these were with the upgraded SX74 with its pristine high frequency cutting. I'd stay away from these early Neumann and I am not sure when they might start with Lyrita. Perhaps there is something in the wax that would help differentiate. That label size difference is very curious.<br /><br />I listened to some of the later pressings in my comparisons. As stated before I was not a fan of the odd non-Decca typeface pressings. However, the hand written lettering pressings (EMI) are impressive. They may seem bright, but I suspect this is a result of the extremely tight, clean, and deep bass foundation giving the highs an added crispness. My Moeran cello concerto EMI press did quite well versus the decca pressing. The decca had nice body to the cello, but the EMI was quite extended with much more lyrical Lyrita highs and really conveyed a nice silkiness in the upper registers of the cello. Other EMI presses I played last night were always much bigger and more dynamic sounding then there decca counterparts.<br /><br />continued....Meleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17803490723541660219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-8030660041605704542014-02-20T14:40:10.346-05:002014-02-20T14:40:10.346-05:00Meles,
Thanks for the detailed review! This is a...Meles,<br /><br />Thanks for the detailed review! This is an album of really wonderful music. I've got a special attachment to the St. Paul Suite, since we played it in our high school orchestra my freshman and junior years. I learned both the first and second violin parts, and it was a lot of fun to play and perform. While I don't believe I own the Lyrita, I happen to have the Musical Heritage Society reissue, which I picked up at a Friends of the Library in the suburbs of Washington, DC for 10 cents. It sounds great, though I haven't been able to compare it to the original. I'll be interested in reading your thoughts about the other Lyritas on your list.<br /><br />AQL aqlamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14158533801520443218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6578688126265821360.post-36357411978135940242014-02-19T22:48:35.062-05:002014-02-19T22:48:35.062-05:00Meles, another fine review and thanks for all the ...Meles, another fine review and thanks for all the background. This is one of the TAS Super Discs, along with its predecessor 33. Wilkie engineered this one, done at Kingsway. I found out that I have three different kinds of Deccas in the first 10 stereo Lyritas! <br />Here is a little list:<br />Catalogue SRCS Album Label Cutting Recorded Issued Engineer Venue<br /> 31 trifold groove 1K 12/65 9/66 Wilkie Kingsway<br /> 32 trifold groove 1K 12/65 9/66 Wilkie Kingsway<br /> 33 strip flat 2K 1/66 10/66 Mailes Kingsway<br /> 34 strip flat 3A 3/66 5/67 Wilkie Kingsway<br /> 35 trifold groove 1G 7/66 5/67 Locke/Parry Kingsway<br /> 36 strip flat 1L 11/67 10/68 Wilkie Kingsway<br /> 37 trifold flat 1L 11/67 10/68 Wilkie Kingsway<br /> 38 strip Dutch Ring 3R/1L 12/67 10/68 Harvey producer West Hampstead<br /> 39 trifold flat 1R 12/67 10/68 Wilkie Walthamstow<br /> 40 trifold flat 1R 1/68 10/68 Wilkie Walthamstow<br /><br />What it looks to me is that the groove pressings correspond to the era of the second groove Deccas (ED2 in Furop's notation or the 'Made in England' groove). The flat pressings are ED3 or Made in England flat. The oddball is my copy of SRCS38 which is clearly a Dutch ring - pressed in Baarn, probably in 1980 or 1981, so very late. It has the Decca information in the deadwax, but no stamper (as in the letter at about 3 O'Clock from the word BUCKINGHAM). So I will be looking for an earlier pressing. I have to listen to it, since these pressings were the ones which drove Itter to go to Nimbus. BTW, the record label says Made in England, though clearly it was not. I have a few late Decca SXL6000's that have the same problem - they are clearly Dutch pressed but still say Made in England rather than Made in Holland.<br /><br />I will be seeing Mike Mailes in June (who did the engineering for 33) and see what he remembers. You can see that Wilkie did almost all of these, with Mailes doing one and Jimmy Locke/Gordon Parry doing another. David Harvey produced all of these as well as most of the early Lyritas. He probably handled the engineering for 38 as well. The recording information comes from Philip Stuart's excellent and comprehensive discography on the CHARM website. He published it on line in 2009 and has since updated it, but not made the updates publicly available.<br /><br />Larry<br /> astrotoyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18238986044554305563noreply@blogger.com